Interview with Andrew Goldsmith, Co-Director of Stop Motion Love Story, "Lost & Found" (Part 2/2 of Interview with "Lost & Found" Directors)
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| Knotjira (left) and Knitsune (right) in Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
The true essence of art – a reflection of life itself – is very much akin to the Japanese aesthetic of “wabi-sabi”: it’s imperfect, impermanent, and, at times, profoundly...incomplete.
It is both at once a fundamental truth, and, curiously, more often than not, a thing incredibly hard to acknowledge, to make peace with. Yet perhaps our resistance is justifiable, for once we admit that the world is full of unknowns – unknowns that aren’t ideal, that aren’t perfect – we are just as soon confronted with the actualization of a deep, intrinsic, and very human fear: the fear of a future full of...unknowns that aren’t ideal, that aren’t perfect. Yet it’s the confrontal of that fear that is the most terrifying reality of all, for the moment we make peace with it we have just as soon have acknowledged that our paths in life aren’t in our own hands, or something we can control – a terrifying reality, yet one that’s nonetheless fundamentally true.
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| Knotjira (foreground) and Knitsune (background) in Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
Yet, in art as in life, it is in this very place, this very nature – the nature of an imperfect, impermanent, and incomplete world – that true beauty is found – a beauty that transcends time, culture, identity. And yet, perhaps it transcends as much as it terrifies – invoking us with an all-consuming desire to disavow it as untruth in exchange for a simpler worldview in hopes that the world will conform to our will – purely because it rings so brightly of truth. It’s a beauty in and of the flawed, the fleeting, the asymmetric. In other words, the beauty lies in the world in which we already live, it lies our art. It’s always been there. We merely have to have the eyes to see it.
In their recent stop motion short film, Lost & Found, Australian filmmakers Bradley Slabe and Andrew Goldsmith have perfectly captured this aesthetic, painting a metaphor with the film’s subject matter that’s beautifully resonate with and, according to co-director Bradley Slabe, inspired by wabi-sabi: That of a crocheted doll traversing a real-world landscape at real-life scale where, in comparison to him, objects are enormous – causing the film’s milieu to become a tremendous distance for him – all in attempts to save his lover from a terrible fate. Though in the process, he is forced to become unraveled, fully knowing that by saving the sole object of his existence, he will have undergone a fundamental change unto a point where he can no longer live life with his lover in the same way, the thing he might have before defined as “ultimate bliss”.
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| Knitsune in Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
“We expanded the story universe and relocated the setting to a sushi bar to align with the aesthetic of Wabi Sabi, a Japanese philosophy that celebrates the impermanence, imperfection and incompleteness of the world,” says Bradley Slabe, co-director of Lost & Found, thus drawing allusions to the film’s themes in the very landscape and fundamental design of the film.
The film’s metaphor proving a profound meditation on the reality of life itself, Lost & Found does much to pluck at the heartstrings as well as to inspire awe with the beauty of its every facet – that of its story, animation, cinematography, editing, sound design, as well as its character and set design and fabrication.
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| Knitsune in Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
Having only just premiered in February of this year at the Berlin International Film Festival in Berlin, Germany, Lost & Found can next be seen at the Sydney Film Festival in Sydney, Australia, which will be going on from the 6th to the 17th of June, which you can learn more about by going here.
The second part of a two-part interview article with the co-directors of Lost & Found, this article will feature Stop Motion Geek’s interview with Andrew Goldsmith, who also co-edited the film. You can read the first part of this article – our interview with Lost & Found co-director Bradley Slabe, who also wrote the film – by going here.
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| Knotjira in Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
In our interview, Goldsmith discusses how his fascination with stop motion and filmmaking has flourished since his first attempts at experimenting with stop motion and various other animation and filmmaking-effect techniques in high school, and where his passion for filmmaking has now led him. He also tells us about his creative partnership with Bradley Slabe, how the two directors worked to make their differences in experience in filmmaking an asset on Lost & Found, and how the two worked together to give direction to the film’s incredibly talented team. He also tells us about his philosophy when it comes to fostering a positive producer-director relationship on a film. Having made films in live actions as well as many styles of animation, Goldsmith also gives us insight into the differences between directing stop motion and practically every other medium. He also gives us an in-depth look at how he and editor John Gavin edited Lost & Found. You can read our interview below in full.
A.H. Uriah: Hello, Andrew! Thank you so much for doing this interview! I’d like to start off by asking you how you first became aware that filmmaking – and specifically filmmaking in the visual effects and animation industry, which you’ve done a fair amount of work in – was, number one, a career which you could have as a “job,” and, secondly, that it was an industry that you wanted to have a part in? Can you give us a brief overview of how you got from the original sparking of your interest in the medium to where you are now – the polymathic creative (as you are a director, VFX supervisor, visual compositor, motion graphics artist, and an editor) behind many commercials, short films, and music videos?
Andrew Goldsmith: It’s my pleasure, A.H., thanks for your interest. It started in high school with the strange and chaotic movies I would make with my friends. Eventually we started experimenting with camera effects and animation techniques like stop motion which got me really excited. I obviously loved watching films as a kid too and was interested in everything from Stanley Kubrick to Jan Svankmajer. When leaving high school I knew I wanted to work in film so I studied Film & Television at university where I learnt about visual effects and further explored mixing different techniques for filmmaking. After studying, I freelanced as a VFX artist, animator and director for many years. Many of my first directing jobs did not have the budgets or resources available to have big teams, so I did a lot of the work myself, sometimes everything from cinematography to the colour grade. Eventually the amount of jobs, income and fulfilling work that came from projects I directed myself increased, as well as the size of the teams I got to work with. Now I almost exclusively direct my own work and get to work with teams made up of a lot of talented people.
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| Andrew Goldsmith applies a heat gun to acetate sheets for water testing. Source: Instagram. |
A.H.: What has your working relationship been like with Lucy J. Hayes, who has been the producer on many of your projects including Lost & Found, Dulux Duramax, Boy & Bear – Limit of Love, Slurpee – New Aussie Fave Flavours, Uniqlo – Suit Your Mood, and Kmart – Life's Short & Imagine Nation? From your experience, what does a positive director-producer relationship add to a project and look like, and how does one on either end – producer or director – work to craft one?
AG: Lucy and I first worked together on a really fun little commercial job that actually never saw the light of day. It involved some visual effects trickery and large scale puppets. Immediately I found Lucy easy to work with, we got along straight away and she was enthusiastic and understanding about the particular challenges and techniques that I chose to use in my work.
For me, a positive director-producer relationship is like any relationship really; If you have respect for each other and communicate well then things are going to be great. Lucy and I have always found it easy to speak openly about what we want to achieve in a particular job, what is and isn’t possible, and what really matters to us. It’s also essential that your passion and a vision for the work is aligned.
As far as crafting a good producer-director relationship I’d say to look for someone with whom you share that passion for making what you think is cool stuff and practice good communication skills with each other!
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| Lucy J. Hayes (left), Andrew Goldsmith (middle), and Bradley Slabe (right). Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
A.H.: One of the things that makes your career such an interesting one to study is the amazing array of mediums that you’ve worked in (as a director and also serving several other different specialties) – live action, stop motion, CG, and mixed medium work. I would love it if you could shed some light on the difference between the performances in stop motion (animation) versus those in live action (in working with actors). Can you describe the differences and similarities between giving an animator direction versus giving an actor direction? I know that it can be hard to sometimes make generalizations about such things, so can you give us an example of your directorial process with a specific actor that you’ve worked with and then contrast it with how you gave direction to Lost & Found’s animator Samuel Lewis (who you’ve done extensive work with on other projects, as well)?
AG: That’s a tough question, because as you mentioned: every project is different. For live action, what may work for one actor or situation may not work in another. But the biggest difference I’ve found with stop motion vs basically every other format is that you have way less opportunities to do multiple takes or passes or work to finesse a particular shot.
In live action you can do as many takes as your schedule on the day allows, it often only takes about the same time to film as the actual screen time. I’ll often approach a shot with a few ideas of different options of how the performance can go.
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| Andrew Goldsmith on the set of Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
In animation this is quite different, but even with traditional 2D or CG you can refine and rework performances without throwing everything away, or work with key poses and then fill in the gaps rather than animate straight ahead.
Stop motion however is often more like a live performance in some ways. You discuss and plan and practice as much as you can and then often you only get 1 shot to get it right. In most stop motion projects I’ve worked on, including Lost & Found, there’s often not enough time or money for a second takes, so you need to be ready and have a super clear vision before you start shooting the first frame. Also as stop motion has to be shot “straight ahead” you need to work out all the timing and overlapping action and blocking in relation to the camera before you roll.
All this means I’ve found I have much more in depth discussions and work out a clear vision for a stop motion animator to work from than I might an actor, as with the actor we can try things on the day or find the right path by shooting multiple takes, with stop motion that is not possible (feasible).
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| Animator Samuel Lewis on the set of Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
A.H.: Can you tell us about how you approached directing Lost & Found – which you co-directed alongside Bradley Slabe – specifically in relation to your partnership with Bradley? How did the two of you meld your creative sensibilities together to – first of all – create a coherent vision for the film (especially considering that he wrote the film), and, secondly, how did you two develop a working relationship and split the workload of the film?
AG: Bradley and I don’t always share the same taste and have had vastly different experiences in filmmaking so our approaches and instincts can often be very different. There is a decent amount of overlap, however, enough to make our differences work to our advantage and become a powerful element of our partnership. Coming from different perspectives meant sometimes we debated about decisions until we came to an agreement. This meant that you had to be sure about your ideas when you brought them to the table because sometimes you’d have to convince another director that it was the way to go.
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| Andrew Goldsmith (left) and Bradley Slabe (right). Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
While we reinvented many story ideas along the way and the film evolved at every stage, as it naturally does, the core of the idea and story between these two characters was there in the first draft from Bradley. And being the writer on set meant he was the custodian of that core story. He would always make sure that what we did with the film sang true to that original idea.
This partly informed how we split the load in co-directing the film. While we collaborated as a partnership in almost every element, Brad’s experience naturally meant his focus was more focussed on story while I covered a lot of the technique and execution.
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| Bradley Slabe (left) and Andrew Goldsmith (right). Photo courtesy of Bradley Slabe. |
Ultimately I feel co-directing can be a super powerful filmmaking approach, helping keep one's perspectives in check, make sure your approaches are justified and to allow you to have someone to not only bounce ideas around with, but fall back on when you need support.
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| Andrew Goldsmith on the set of Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
A.H.: From looking at your work, I can see that you often work with the same people across many of your projects, specifically Lucy J. Hayes as a producer, Samuel Lewis as a stop motion animator, and Gerald Thompson as a motion controller. What did having a “built in team,” as it were, give you on Lost & Found? How did having established working relationships with them affect your decision making, especially when it came to taking risks and really pushing the medium to its limits that you’re working in (stop motion in the case of Lost & Found)? Lastly, how did having such a familiar team affect your relationships with your associates on Lost & Found who you were working with for the first time?
AG: Finding people that you get along with, are on the same page with creatively, and that are talented and dedicated is a rare thing! That’s why when you do you find them, you tend to work with them over and over again. Almost everyone on the team was someone I’ve worked and/or collaborated with before, including in art department, post production and music. Also, many of the team themselves had worked together, which made for a warmer and friendlier work environment where everyone felt comfortable and wanted to help everyone else out across departments.
A big benefit of this is we got momentum quickly. Instead of taking time to learn how to work with each other and find the best process, a lot of things quickly clicked into place, as we’ve done it before together and we know what works. Having a short hand with crew, and understanding their strengths and how they liked to work also made things much easier.
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| Bradley Slabe (right), Andrew Goldsmith (middle), and Gerald Thompson (left) on the set of Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
It was an incredibly ambitious film where all crew had to push themselves far further than they usually would on a normal project, making strong working relationships with people you can trust essential. If you’re all going to work so hard together on something you believe in, you also have to believe in each other.
Basically everyone who joined the team at least knew someone else who was already on the project, so there was always a way in, which I think helps. For my co-director Brad, most these people were new to him, as was working with a big team, but he wasn’t directing them on his own so he didn’t have to come in cold, because we already had our working relationship.
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| Knotjira (dinosaur doll) on the set of Lost & Found. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
A.H.: On Lost & Found, as well as being the co-director, you also were the co-editor along with John Gavin. When you and John Gavin sat down to edit Lost & Found, how much “shape” did the film already take in your mind and how did you and John Gavin work to shape it into the film that we now see, both in relation to the visuals as well as the sound design and musical composition?
AG: John was a very late addition to the team but he made a huge impact. As with most animation, and particularly stop motion, the first edit happens well before you start shooting. After Bradley and I refined the story beats and all the storyboards were set, we edited the first animatic. We then started the shoot using our animatic as a guide and then started plugging finished shots in as soon as they were done. While shooting we would continue to refine the edit, I worked closely with Bradley and we would change up sequences, removing and adding new shots to make things work better with the new footage that had come in. Once the entire shoot was done we made a refined cut and most of the film you see today was there. But we felt it could be stronger, we knew there was more that could be done but we couldn’t quite crack the code. That’s when John came on board.
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| A shot of Knitsune taken with Dragonframe. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
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| Lost & Found set. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
A.H.: What’s next for you? What dreams do you have yet to fulfill and how are you working towards accomplishing them?
AG: I’m looking forward to continuing to create more work using all the techniques that interest and inspire me. I think there’s so much more that can be explored within the world of animation and particularly in stop motion, it’s a magical medium that always inspires and fascinates me. I’ve been doing a lot of advertising work lately, which I find is a great way to find a budget to explore complex ideas with fast turnarounds and, honing my craft and working with and learning from awesome people.
Eventually long form projects that incorporate my love of effects and animation is something I strive for. On the way there, I’m happy to continue to tell whatever size or shape stories I get the opportunity to, using as inventive an approach as I can find.
You can watch Lost & Found in full – released online as of December 6th, 2018 – by going here. You can watch the trailer for the film by going here. You can learn more about the film by visiting its brilliantly adorable and incredibly insightful Instagram profile, as well its Facebook and website. You can watch the film’s behind-the-scenes featurette by going here.
You can read the first part of this article – our interview with Bradley Slabe, the film’s co-director – by going here.
This article is the second in a series of articles featuring Stop Motion Geek’s interviews with the team behind Lost & Found. You can stay tuned for the upcoming articles by subscribing to Stop Motion Geek via the “subscribe” button at the top right corner of our homepage, or by following us on Facebook @StopMotionGeek, or by visiting https://www.facebook.com/StopMotionGeek/. You can also stay up-to-date with the blog by following us on Instagram or @stop.motion.geek.blog.
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| Lost & Found poster. Photo courtesy of Andrew Goldsmith. |
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